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Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

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  • Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

    hey fellow gun lovers. from the post in the general discussion about purchasing pistol ammo at 18 years of age.

    i can't seem to find anywhere in the florida statutes that says i need to be 21 to buy. is it just a joint store thing or is it a law? i've been getting mixed responses from my question.

    places that have said i needed to be 21 is. al's army navy, east orange shooting sports, shoot straight.

    can someone let me know? its not hard for me to get ammo but i want to know for sure.
    U.S. Army

  • #2
    Re: Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

    You won't find in the Florida Statutes, but in Federal Law.

    The "Youth Handgun Safety Amendment to the 1994 Federal Crime Bill.

    In this amendment for firearms dealers to sell firearms or ammunition the age must be 21.
    "Always at your command"

    לפקודה תמיד אנחנו

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

      oh ok, finally a conclusive answer.

      thank you very much.
      U.S. Army

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

        Originally posted by Jdo451
        oh ok, finally a conclusive answer.

        thank you very much.
        Actually, not exactly conclusive, because I forgot to mention that you can buy ammunition for a rifle at 18. It is ammunition for a handgun which is restricted.
        "Always at your command"

        לפקודה תמיד אנחנו

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

          yeah i knew that much.
          U.S. Army

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

            Originally posted by Palmach
            You won't find in the Florida Statutes, but in Federal Law.

            The "Youth Handgun Safety Amendment to the 1994 Federal Crime Bill.

            In this amendment for firearms dealers to sell firearms or ammunition the age must be 21.
            http://www.rkba.org/federal/crime-bi...irearms.1sep94

            (a) Offense.--Section 922 of title 18, United States Code,
            as amended by section 110103(a), is amended by adding at the
            end the following new subsection:
            ``(x)(1) It shall be unlawful for a person to sell,
            deliver, or otherwise transfer to a person who the transferor
            knows or has reasonable cause to believe is a juvenile--
            ``(A) a handgun; or
            ``(B) ammunition that is suitable for use only in a
            handgun.
            ``(2) It shall be unlawful for any person who is a juvenile
            to knowingly possess--
            ``(A) a handgun; or
            ``(B) ammunition that is suitable for use only in a
            handgun.
            ``(5) For purposes of this subsection, the term `juvenile'
            means a person who is less than 18 years of age.

            IS THAT CONCLUSIVE ENOUGH!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :D
            Hope this helps, if not, oh well.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

              The issue that he brought up in his original post was that several gun stores or ranges told him that they could not sell to him as he is not 21, and this is correct.

              The federal statute does not allow a FFL to sell either handguns or handgun ammunition to anyone under 21.

              What the law does not cover is the issue of private sale, or gifting. An 18yr old can purchase a handgun in a private sale, or receive it as a gift. However, they are still unable to purchase ammunition for that handgun from an FFL.
              "Always at your command"

              לפקודה תמיד אנחנו

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

                thanks guys for answering my question. now i have 3 and some change years till i can get my concealed licenses and my own ammo.

                too bad the clerk can't 'gift' me ammo, and then out of gratitude i 'gift' him green paper.
                U.S. Army

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

                  Originally posted by Palmach
                  The issue that he brought up in his original post was that several gun stores or ranges told him that they could not sell to him as he is not 21, and this is correct.

                  The federal statute does not allow a FFL to sell either handguns or handgun ammunition to anyone under 21.

                  What the law does not cover is the issue of private sale, or gifting. An 18yr old can purchase a handgun in a private sale, or receive it as a gift. However, they are still unable to purchase ammunition for that handgun from an FFL.

                  Read the law posted above, 18 is the magic age not 21. Read the law, it is posted above and the full text is referenced.
                  The law is 18, not 21.

                  Federal law is 18, state make it 21. That is why some states allow CWL at 18.
                  Hope this helps, if not, oh well.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

                    Read the law posted above, 18 is the magic age not 21. Read the law, it is posted above and the full text is referenced.
                    The law is 18, not 21.

                    Federal law is 18, state make it 21. That is why some states allow CWL at 18.
                    Stainless,

                    I am sorry, but on this one you are wrong.

                    This is from 18 U.S.C. 922, which as I stated prior is part of the Youth Handgun Saftety Act signed by Clinton in 1994.

                    Gutmacher also quotes this code in his book regarding the 21yr requirement to purchase ammunition from any FFL.

                    (b) It shall be unlawful for any licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to sell or deliver—
                    (1) any firearm or ammunition to any individual who the licensee knows or has reasonable cause to believe is less than eighteen years of age, and, if the firearm, or ammunition is other than a shotgun or rifle, or ammunition for a shotgun or rifle, to any individual who the licensee knows or has reasonable cause to believe is less than twenty-one years of age;


                    This coincides with what I said above. At 18 you can purchase a long gun and long gun ammunition from an FFL, but handguns and handgun ammunition is still 21.
                    "Always at your command"

                    לפקודה תמיד אנחנו

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

                      Ok so if i was to go to walmart and wanted Hand gun ammo while i was 18 could they or not sell me the ammunition? How bout the gun range?

                      I know at a gun dealer you have to be 21 to buy hand gun ammo which i want to know 100%

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

                        Originally posted by Mr. X
                        Ok so if i was to go to walmart and wanted Hand gun ammo while i was 18 could they or not sell me the ammunition? How bout the gun range?

                        I know at a gun dealer you have to be 21 to buy hand gun ammo which i want to know 100%
                        It is not about a gun dealer, it is about a Federal Firearms License. All stores, ranges, and dealers have a FFL, and thus are required to adhere to the above code, which prohibits sale of handgun ammunition to anyone under 21.
                        "Always at your command"

                        לפקודה תמיד אנחנו

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

                          Originally posted by Palmach
                          Read the law posted above, 18 is the magic age not 21. Read the law, it is posted above and the full text is referenced.
                          The law is 18, not 21.

                          Federal law is 18, state make it 21. That is why some states allow CWL at 18.
                          Stainless,

                          I am sorry, but on this one you are wrong.

                          This is from 18 U.S.C. 922, which as I stated prior is part of the Youth Handgun Saftety Act signed by Clinton in 1994.

                          Gutmacher also quotes this code in his book regarding the 21yr requirement to purchase ammunition from any FFL.

                          (b) It shall be unlawful for any licensed importer, licensed manufacturer, licensed dealer, or licensed collector to sell or deliver—
                          (1) any firearm or ammunition to any individual who the licensee knows or has reasonable cause to believe is less than eighteen years of age, and, if the firearm, or ammunition is other than a shotgun or rifle, or ammunition for a shotgun or rifle, to any individual who the licensee knows or has reasonable cause to believe is less than twenty-one years of age;


                          This coincides with what I said above. At 18 you can purchase a long gun and long gun ammunition from an FFL, but handguns and handgun ammunition is still 21.

                          I do not know what a "Gutmacher" is (joke) but here is an excerpt of the law and an opinon from the Washington AG on its interpretation:
                          RCW 9.41.110(3) provides as follows: "No dealer may sell or otherwise transfer, or expose for sale or transfer, or have in his or her possession with intent to sell, or otherwise transfer, any ammunition without being licensed as provided in this section." However, RCW 9.41.010(10) defines the term "dealer" as "a person engaged in the business of selling firearms or ammunition at wholesale or retail who has, or is required to have, a federal firearms license under 18 U.S.C. Sec. 923(a)". 18 U.S.C. § 923(a) provides that: "No person shall engage in the business of importing, manufacturing, or dealing in firearms, or importing or manufacturing ammunition, until he has filed an application with and received a license to do so from the Secretary". (Emphasis added.) The ammunition licensing requirement under federal law only applies to persons who are engaged in the business of importing or manufacturing ammunition, and unlike the firearms licensing requirement, does not apply to persons who deal in ammunition. Therefore, a person who only deals in ammunition, and does not import or manufacture it or deal in firearms, is not required to have a license under 18 U.S.C. § 923(a).[3]
                          Now, it is not necessary to have an FFL to sell ammo. This is why there are businesses that sell ammo only. There is not an FFL requirement to sell ammo. Therefore, it is not necessary to comply with the "Licensee" requirement if you only sell ammo and do not have an FFL.

                          Furthermore, even the law itself is ambiquous, because there is no such thing as "rifle" or "pistol" ammo since 18 U.S.C. § 923 even defines a handgun by characteristics and not caliber. Therefore, how can a dealer restrict sales of "handgun" ammo to a person under 21, when the code does not list what falls within this category. The restriction can not be upheld in a court of law since there are rifles that fire every caliber of ammo refered to as "pistol" ammo.

                          I am not a lawyer and will not tell you that I know everything that there is, however, I do work with a group within the NRA, who's mission is to lobby, write, interpret, teach and defend laws involving firearms.

                          Final decision:
                          1. If the dealer involved in the transaction is a firearm dealer and has an FFL, then they must comply with the section you listed.
                          2. If the dealer is not an FFL and simply sells ammo, then they are not licensed and not required to comply with this section.
                          3. If they are an FFL and refuse to sell "pistol" ammo, than ask them what constitutes "pistol" ammo and where they get the list. If it is a true gun shop, then they probabaly sell rifles in the desired caliber and may be convinced to sell it to you based on this information.

                          I am not trying to be argumentative with anyone here, I just want to make sure that we are all reading laws regarding the legality and not being influenced by too many opinions and such. As with most laws, especially ones about guns, there are many sections related to each topic and all laws must be examined thoroughly. Also, you must remember that laws are restrictive by nature and that unless a law specifically addresses an issue then it does not cover it completely.
                          Hope this helps, if not, oh well.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

                            I am not a lawyer and will not tell you that I know everything that there is, however, I do work with a group within the NRA, who's mission is to lobby, write, interpret, teach and defend laws involving firearms.
                            To answer your previous question on what a "Gutmacher" is, he is one of the experts on firearms law who wrote the go to book in Florida on firearms law. He is an attorney.

                            Since you are involved in the a group with the NRA, I thought I would post this link http://www.nraila.org/GunLaws/Federal/Read.aspx?id=60, which lead to
                            "A Citizen's Guide to Federal Firearms Law." I have also posted the relevant section from their website bolded below.

                            Ammunition

                            As with firearms, shipments of ammunition must be accompanied by a written notice of the shipment`s contents. It is unlawful for any licensed importer, dealer, manufacturer or collector to transfer shotgun or rifle ammunition to anyone under the age of 18, or any handgun ammunition to anyone under the age of 21.

                            It is illegal to manufacture or sell armor-piercing handgun ammunition.


                            Final decision:
                            1. If the dealer involved in the transaction is a firearm dealer and has an FFL, then they must comply with the section you listed.
                            Absolutely, and the only reason I have been adamant on this point is because the several places that he described who were unwilling to sell to him, all are required to maintain a FFL. They were either retail establishments or gun ranges.

                            2. If the dealer is not an FFL and simply sells ammo, then they are not licensed and not required to comply with this section.
                            I agree with this as well. However, as stated above, the issue was that most of the places he was being turned down did so because they are Federally licensed.

                            3. If they are an FFL and refuse to sell "pistol" ammo, than ask them what constitutes "pistol" ammo and where they get the list. If it is a true gun shop, then they probabaly sell rifles in the desired caliber and may be convinced to sell it to you based on this information.
                            Now this is where it gets interesting, and where the liability is not on the seller, but on the buyer. As you have already noted, since there are many handgun calibers that are also rifle calibers it is incumbent for the licensed seller to specifically ask if this is for a handgun or a long gun. If the buyer lies and in fact the seller does sell to them, the buyer has committed a felony. Since, I believe the OP has a Glock, I would assume that a purchase of 9mm or .45 ACP would not be consistent with most typical rifle calibers.

                            I am not trying to be argumentative with anyone here, I just want to make sure that we are all reading laws regarding the legality and not being influenced by too many opinions and such.
                            I am not trying to be argumentative at all either. I like a good discussion, and often times we all learn from these, and present some great info to others that read our interactions. Other than the laws that I posted, the only opinion I presented was that of a respected 2nd Amendment Attorney.

                            As with most laws, especially ones about guns, there are many sections related to each topic and all laws must be examined thoroughly. Also, you must remember that laws are restrictive by nature and that unless a law specifically addresses an issue then it does not cover it completely.
                            I fully agree. The issue still remains that most people, not all, but most who sell ammo are generally also Federally licensed, and will comply with the 21yr old age limit. I also know of many of the ammo only dealers that will also comply with 21 if they can to avoid any hassles.

                            The most important thing to remember for the 18-21yr old to keep in mind is the potential criminal liability they open themselves up to if they lie in order to obtain handgun ammunition. While some laws might be ambiguous, nobody ever wants to be the test case.

                            I have enjoyed our discussion, and hope we can continue to learn even when we disagree.


                            Regards,

                            Palmach
                            "Always at your command"

                            לפקודה תמיד אנחנו

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: Florida Statutes on Ammunition Sales

                              Well if i wanted to ask for 9mm rounds and its for a Hi-point 9mm carbine rifle can anyone say anything???

                              Comment


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